From the Process Model of Awakening post, there have been several related discussion threads. Jerry Freeman and I agree that the Oneness and Emptiness threads are the same thread at different stages or from different subjective orientations. This is what I call the Atman process, the process in consciousness. In my experience, there are stages in processes.
I’ve talked to Pierce and some other researchers and have noticed a strong resistance to using a stages model for enlightenment. Not just to avoid leaning on a tradition, but a resistance to the entire approach. I find this curious as many researchers, such as Piaget, Loevinger, Kohlberg, Maslow, and Alexander, study human development through a stages lens.
However, in some Eastern spiritual circles, models of stages are rejected. I suspect this is the influence. This historical rejection can be for several reasons.
– Part of some teachings is rejecting other teachings.
For example, Buddha rejected the complexity and superficiality of the common practices of the day and brought things back to their fundamentals. For some, rejecting all terms and models from the prior tradition became baked in. For example, they rejected words like Brahman and Atman.
– Different people experience the process differently.
The model has to be based on the fundamental process, not on categories of subjective experience. These experiences are symptoms, not the process itself. This is a common research flaw.
With a model of the underlying process, you can then categorize experiences into the process properly. Some things that sound different are actually the same process (Atman above, for example). And some things that sound the same are different (emptiness and Brahman, for example).
– Stages are concepts, not reality.
Agreed, but context and understanding can be very valuable in the process so that we can support what is unfolding and don’t struggle. The map is not the road, but maps are still valuable during the journey.
– Stages imply time, whereas the shifts are beyond time.
Also true. The stage changes are in our relationship with consciousness, in a larger timelessness container. However, we live them in time and space. We experience a process and a sequence of unfolding. Time gives the experience of stages, so it’s good to support the process as it’s experienced. Then we can recognize what is behind the experience is beyond time.
This last point is important, as I’ve seen people confuse the side effects with the awakening. Flashy experiences and/or purification with a shift may cause confusion about what actually changed. Then we’re not supporting integrating consciousness. We can fall back into the mind’s desire for control, chase experiences, or resist what actually woke up.
In the integration and embodiment process, all of this will sort itself out and become supremely inclusive. But if we can support the process as it’s unfolding, we’ll enjoy a smoother ride.
Davidya
Yea I feel that the value of a model is based on whether it helps someone understand their own experiences or not. A few years ago what was going on for me was more easily explained using the stages model. Now I feel that what I’ve been going through is easier to understand through the threads model. It might change in the future. I’m just happy we have these tools to make sense of things.
Agreed, Olli.
Our unfolding is a blend of stages and threads (processes) and so different framing can help serve us at different times.